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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Domination #17 - Shit news - Here's the proper story!
What's the big idea posting shit about Excess and me as an Excess member? I'm not an Excess member. We know who the culprit is posting shit about Excess, when it wasn't Excess' fault but mine.
I admit that I passed my game 'Bomb Chase' to St0rmfr0nt/Excess via Email, because Urine (or should I say Onslaught) had first released a beta-version of this game which weren't meant to be spread. Later on, St0rmfr0nt/Excess firstreleased a properly trained version of this game (Which loads of people enjoyed) and added to the releasenote about Urine's version of the game being beta.
A day later St0rmfr0nt Emailed me asking me why I did a fake Excess release of Bomb Chase, and that I wasn't a member or Excess (Nor shall I be because I'm in 2 groups already). I told St0rmfr0nt the truth and told him that there's a lamer somewhere who probably thought it would be funny to do a fake Excess release.
I was really pissed off and we were suspicious that Jazzcat could have been behind the prank, after the Urine release had proved to be some fake. Urine tried to re-release the proper version of Bomb Chase but failed, because I asked all FTP owners to remove the release, as I had a feeling that Urine was really going to piss hard on my work.
I come up with a cunning plan (not so clever) which was create a FAKE ONSLAUGHT firstrelease of the same game. I also uploaded a few versions of Bomb Chase (Not Excess ones though, but TND. One with TND intro with a message attacking Onslaught, and another with no intro). I also uploaded a note to remove the fakes and just keep the genuine TND (intro-less) version of my game, and also the PROPER 'Excess' version of the game.
And (pant, pant) that's how the story goes. I am NOT (i repeat) NOT and Excess member, but a regular friendly contact with Excess. But from now on, I think I should let other groups try first releases of my work - for competition, no matter what. The Urine of Bomb Chase must have been some sort of joke. That game was too good to be lame - or was it to do with the graphics I prepared using Jon's the Multi-Screen Construction Kit?
If anyone adds to any news any more crap about either TND or Excess. We will be sure to bite back. Just wait and see.
I apologise for the grief I have cause concerning the uploading of the FTP's, but now....I think we are owed an apology! |
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zyruz
Account closed
Posts: 33 |
heh, calm down! ;) .. you simply take the whole c-64stuff far to serious.. don't you? *g ...remember, c-64 is fun not real life stuff.
just my 2cents. |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Quote: heh, calm down! ;) .. you simply take the whole c-64stuff far to serious.. don't you? *g ...remember, c-64 is fun not real life stuff.
just my 2cents.
...and Urine pissing on my work? Is that supposed to be fun, when it's mostly my good quality game releases like Bomb Chase? (When other groups don't get at it?)
I enjoy creating games, but I don't enjoy the grief of Urine pissing on my work - unless it was poor-quality tat. |
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TDJ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1879 |
But it's not up to you alone to decide if it's shit poor .. not that I say it is (because I don't care for your games so I don't check them out - don't take it personal, I don't care for any c64 game anymore) but Urine might feel that way. |
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Warbaby
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 60 |
Richard, sometimes you take things a bit too seriously. You post everything you think. That's why you're such an easy target for silly pranks. |
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Slator
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 273 |
I don't care for any PD games, what is the point to do first releases of games every sucker can download on the internet?
There is no need for that. And if excess believes that is is a good idea to release them then it is ok. That is the main reason for urine stuff (and I don't do them anyway).
I prefer one metal warrior in 3 years than 10 games by richard in 1 week.
I don't say that Richard should stop his game coding, but he should think a bit before writing anything he doesn't have a clue of. Claiming to be the king of the scene because of some small < 100 blocks games is not really what I like on ppl. Not that anyone cares of what I think anyways. The scene like it was in the past is gone for a long time... a "crackerscene" (if you want to call it like that) is just happening in the re-releasing of old games as you need some knowledge and dedication to reach the quality you want for yourself. I nthe past you gained laughter for PD and not points...
regards
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
Owe an apology? all the tiny little troubles in the scene always have a common object - RICHARD - if it is SealSex, Urine, Onslaught, Excess or DaLaxatives.
No apologies are given, if there is incorrect news it gets corrected in the following edition.
Regarding game quality, fake lables and releases being 'pissed' on. I cannot say much more than what Slator has said. Except that public domain games have always been pissed on, groups releasing only these type of games should be competing with the lamer lables like Urine.
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fade
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 290 |
Quote:
>I come up with a cunning plan (not so clever) which was create a FAKE ONSLAUGHT firstrelease of the same game.
Natural selection says you should have died many moons ago.. |
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Stryyker
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 465 |
"Why are people so unkind?", wise man once said that. Lighten up Richard. It's also easy for anyone to stick some other groups intro in front. Atleast you have plenty of passion. |
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taper
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 119 |
Someone is taking himself far to serious for sure.
We in TRIAD decided to stay as far away as possible from any TND games after all the fuzz with beta's, different versions, bugfixes, 100% versions, originals being uploaded to the firstrelease ftp's and so on. And what about that TND intro, is it the gameintro or is it a crackintro? I have the feeling Onslaught has the same view on this.
I can honestly say I have never seen such a lame mess in the crackingscene for as long as I've been active. The scene has changed a lot over the years, but this takes the price.
...and my opinion still stands, I see no point in releasing freely available PD games if they are not improved in some way. Linking an intro, adding as much as 40 blocks in some cases to the original filesize and not provide any kind of trainers, bugfixes or (obviously) shortening should be punished hard.
By the way, there are still other originals than TND games to obtain these days, occasional new commercial games from Go64!/Commodore Scene/protovision, but also a lot of unreleased titles from the past hidden away in coders and old software houses dusty diskboxes. Just a hint to some. |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Quote: I don't care for any PD games, what is the point to do first releases of games every sucker can download on the internet?
There is no need for that. And if excess believes that is is a good idea to release them then it is ok. That is the main reason for urine stuff (and I don't do them anyway).
I prefer one metal warrior in 3 years than 10 games by richard in 1 week.
I don't say that Richard should stop his game coding, but he should think a bit before writing anything he doesn't have a clue of. Claiming to be the king of the scene because of some small < 100 blocks games is not really what I like on ppl. Not that anyone cares of what I think anyways. The scene like it was in the past is gone for a long time... a "crackerscene" (if you want to call it like that) is just happening in the re-releasing of old games as you need some knowledge and dedication to reach the quality you want for yourself. I nthe past you gained laughter for PD and not points...
regards
<Politically correct police>
Please use the author-neutral term "Turrican" to refer to a side-view alldirectional game. Thank you.
</Politically correct police>
:)))) |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Hang on, you guys just helped me learn my lesson about how the C64 scene should run. I just realised about what I had said yesterday. Duh, what a lamer I am.
There's something I should have listened to, which someone commented here and that is that those people who do fake labels i.e., Da Laxatives (Hang on that was me - I wont bring 'em back), SealSEX, Urine, Secret, etc. Are not actually trying to target my work all the time, but release firsties of several games - for fun. You guys were not trying to be nasty, but fancy a laugh. I'm going to need to stop being cloth ears and I must stop verbally attacking groups who do fake labels of my releases and their comments, as it is meant to be harmless fun.
I think I owe everyone an apology (As you said in the Email Jazzcat - I'm worse than George Bush, and seem to be the biggest lamer of the scene). All this fuss about fake releases and that I should stop. - And all this fuss will stop. It's meant to be harmless fun anyway and you people enjoy it.
Thanks for your advice, and commentry regarding what I said. I think some things I say go too far, and I don't realise that it is something I should have expected with my work.
I like to look at these FTPs to see who has done firstreleases of my work, and check out those intros and how well those people cracked my work.
It goes to show that framing other groups does not help.
A wrap on the knuckles to me, and so sorry for all this grief I caused. I hope you lot will still support me with my work.
Richard! |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Quote: Someone is taking himself far to serious for sure.
We in TRIAD decided to stay as far away as possible from any TND games after all the fuzz with beta's, different versions, bugfixes, 100% versions, originals being uploaded to the firstrelease ftp's and so on. And what about that TND intro, is it the gameintro or is it a crackintro? I have the feeling Onslaught has the same view on this.
I can honestly say I have never seen such a lame mess in the crackingscene for as long as I've been active. The scene has changed a lot over the years, but this takes the price.
...and my opinion still stands, I see no point in releasing freely available PD games if they are not improved in some way. Linking an intro, adding as much as 40 blocks in some cases to the original filesize and not provide any kind of trainers, bugfixes or (obviously) shortening should be punished hard.
By the way, there are still other originals than TND games to obtain these days, occasional new commercial games from Go64!/Commodore Scene/protovision, but also a lot of unreleased titles from the past hidden away in coders and old software houses dusty diskboxes. Just a hint to some.
These intros are meant to be game intros, but as you said they look like 'crack' intros. This is because they are intros to show my software label. Maybe you would prefer it if I removed those intro screens from my games or not add any intros to these games. If this is the case, then I'll be happy to not use them intros, unless it is a demo, or small tool.
TND is games software label of mine, not cracking group LOL! |
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Slator
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 273 |
Dear Richard,
just let the intros be what they are meant for, introducing a production. There is nothing wrong in having a TND Intro infront of your own game. It sounds ok to me.
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Yeah, as long as you don't impersonate any cracking group, you're just fine with your TND intros. Personally, if I was you, I'd only upload releases to homepage, and stay clear of the scene FTPs completely. The releases will find their way there one way or another.
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Okay. |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
The Cosine stuff goes out with an intro on it for two reasons. Either we did all the linking and crunching work so why let anyone else get away with introlinking to that (Commodore Zone stuff was always onefiled and crunched fairly cleanly) or, in the case of Co-Axis, i put quite a bit of work into defreezing it and patching the bugs.
In the latter case, it's almost a crack (although nobody gave me any points for all that work!) since i built it from a ten-year-old frozen original without the source... =-) |
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Moloch
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 2896 |
After reading this posting from Richard and others he has posted other places - all I can say is be glad it's 2002. If you were doing all this nonsense back when there was a "real" wares scene you'd be crushed...
Sometimes people do release things under lamer labels to mess with the group that cracked it or made it. Good example was a full price game Arcade cracked and they gave to NEI for releasing. Horrible quality game... wasn't worth the NEI name. So I slapped an AFROS intro on the front and released it. Thinking back, I did the same thing with a crack from G*P also. Which lead to lots of fun both times... :)
Just keep in mind - this is 2002. Your serious attitude could've helped you, or maybe hindered depending which group you joined, back in 1988. These days I believe most people do this for fun.
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Quote: After reading this posting from Richard and others he has posted other places - all I can say is be glad it's 2002. If you were doing all this nonsense back when there was a "real" wares scene you'd be crushed...
Sometimes people do release things under lamer labels to mess with the group that cracked it or made it. Good example was a full price game Arcade cracked and they gave to NEI for releasing. Horrible quality game... wasn't worth the NEI name. So I slapped an AFROS intro on the front and released it. Thinking back, I did the same thing with a crack from G*P also. Which lead to lots of fun both times... :)
Just keep in mind - this is 2002. Your serious attitude could've helped you, or maybe hindered depending which group you joined, back in 1988. These days I believe most people do this for fun.
I am starting to uderstand about the scene of today now. I did not realise that these people were just doing these silly things for fun :) |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
That depends on how you define "silly" really, if you made an arse of yourself for any reason in the Olde Days (tm) everyone else would be down on you like a ton of bricks. These days, they're more sarcastic than anything else... |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
I'd better behave. :) |
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Dane
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 421 |
21 posts about some Bayliss-related news in an issue of Domination focusing on the demo scene - none about Twoflower's fabulous article on the state of the scene today and what can be done about it. Why bother with this anymore? Whether Richard has released a crap release under this or that name doesn't matter a flying f**k to me, but apparently it does to others. And it seems it's of bloody importance to him as well. Forgive me, but I thought there were better things to do. You guys ever heard of demos? |
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Pater Pi
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 121 |
Demos?
Aren't those games wich lack some features and only have 1 or 2 levels to make people buy the full version? |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
I am with DANE on this one, one small 'human' error and all these posts regarding it. Yet hours and hours and hours of work put into other things within the mag and not a damn whisper.
I am sorry, but "Domination" and "shit"news don't belong in the same sentence.
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
This is cheap soap-opera on the boards :)
Perhaps Twoflower's article was too well written, and people thought that just posting "yeah, well said" or "agree 100%" wouldn't be worth it. I'd like to see some responses from SCPU & C=1 fans... :)
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Warbaby
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 60 |
Domination is one of the few REAL mags of today. It's great the way it is but I think it's time for a new outfit. |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3036 |
Quote: Domination is one of the few REAL mags of today. It's great the way it is but I think it's time for a new outfit.
;-) this is what we in Dmagic internally call *wannabe improvement request*. Takes more time than it's worth.
Changing well working engines is a waste of time, it's goot that authors rather concentrate on more-or-less regular releases of the magazine.
Roman |
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Pater Pi
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 121 |
No new outfit, this is how we know and love Domination 8) |
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Richard
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 619 |
Anyway, the good bits about Domination #17.
I found loads of articles pretty interesting, including a scene related discussion regarding the cracking scene. I also enjoyed the interviews, not to mention the goodies you gave away. Well done. Let's see more.
I think it would be even more cool if Domination had been produced more often, something like quarterly. I'm hoping that this would gain more readership. It would be nice to see more like this.
BTW: Ignore the stupid things I done regarding releases. |
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hollowman
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 474 |
the outfit is great, no need to do anything about it
as for twoflowers article, i can agree on the hard words against the idlers and the big mouths who talk a lot but produce nothing, and i dont care much for scpu users or welle erdballs musical contribution for mekka either.
however i do find the bashing of those who dont respect the limits of the c64 unnecessary. 4x4, ifli and c64 techno might have been something to complain about if any demos of that kind were actually released nowadays. reflex and smash designs are mentioned as example of how 'wrong' things went. when was the last time reflex released a demo? 5 years ago?
in the opinion poll chapter the question is asked if its good or not with demos mainly being released at parties.
maybe its just me, but i have a feeling that hardly any demos at all have been released this year.
if i try to think of what good demos i've seen in 2002 i can perhaps come up with five if i try real hard. and its not just that the overall quality has been low, its the amount thats been bad.
if there were any releases worth being called demos, there could have been a reason to look at them and criticize, now i just yawn instead and try to think of a reason why i should continue doing stuff myself.
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Matt
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 593 |
Quote: Anyway, the good bits about Domination #17.
I found loads of articles pretty interesting, including a scene related discussion regarding the cracking scene. I also enjoyed the interviews, not to mention the goodies you gave away. Well done. Let's see more.
I think it would be even more cool if Domination had been produced more often, something like quarterly. I'm hoping that this would gain more readership. It would be nice to see more like this.
BTW: Ignore the stupid things I done regarding releases.
the mag definitely shouldn't be released more often, no way!
if you ask for quality, let those people release the magazine as often they think it's necessary. it's about quality and not about quantity me thinks.
btw, I really enjoyed reading the last issue.
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3036 |
Quote: the outfit is great, no need to do anything about it
as for twoflowers article, i can agree on the hard words against the idlers and the big mouths who talk a lot but produce nothing, and i dont care much for scpu users or welle erdballs musical contribution for mekka either.
however i do find the bashing of those who dont respect the limits of the c64 unnecessary. 4x4, ifli and c64 techno might have been something to complain about if any demos of that kind were actually released nowadays. reflex and smash designs are mentioned as example of how 'wrong' things went. when was the last time reflex released a demo? 5 years ago?
in the opinion poll chapter the question is asked if its good or not with demos mainly being released at parties.
maybe its just me, but i have a feeling that hardly any demos at all have been released this year.
if i try to think of what good demos i've seen in 2002 i can perhaps come up with five if i try real hard. and its not just that the overall quality has been low, its the amount thats been bad.
if there were any releases worth being called demos, there could have been a reason to look at them and criticize, now i just yawn instead and try to think of a reason why i should continue doing stuff myself.
Yeah. I've been at Cult party #11 on the 3rd november weekend and all slovak ex-sceners were quite bored by the latest C64 production, your demos were praised the most (maybe that's reason why you should continue doing them ;-)).
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Pater Pi
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 121 |
See it from the positive side: it can't become much worse.
I hope that there will be some more action within the scene during winter and next year.
And yep, i know that i also was among those lazy guys. |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
I was really upset to read about Scene World considerated a PATHETIC mag. Well, SW won't be probably the best mag around but that word "pathetic" is too hard at my eyes !!!
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Stryyker
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 465 |
No one wants their own productions put down but now we restirct free voice? I guess most people have issues with SW because of content, some chapters show promise but don't go anyware. The diskmag reviews tell us nothing, I far longer than the reviews. |
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Rough
Account closed
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1829 |
Richard, would you please stop excusing yourself every single time someone else doesn't like your words or action! It's annoying. And, please, do not post "Okay" or "I'm sorry" or similar now. Thanks. |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3036 |
Quote: Richard, would you please stop excusing yourself every single time someone else doesn't like your words or action! It's annoying. And, please, do not post "Okay" or "I'm sorry" or similar now. Thanks.
WORD. |
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Puterman
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 188 |
Overkiller: You were upset? Well, it is pretty pathetic. |
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MorGorr
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 47 |
Sorry to interfere... but I thought it MIGHT be helpful to point out that in German, the word "pathetisch" does not have as negative connotations as it has in English. |
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fade
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 290 |
My English German Dictionary has a tampon named as a twatstika :) |
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Pater Pi
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 121 |
Argl..
who would want to put a svastika there?
(no, i prefer to NOT know) |
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Eyeth
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 98 |
Hello.
Has someone successfully viewed Domination #17 under emulators such as winVICE's x64 or CCS64? I tried viewing it under x64 and got all of the intro sequence.
But, it locked up when there was a tall blue screen with a black border. There was no text on it.
Does anyone have Twoflower's article? The discussion in this thread has somewhat piquied my curiosity.
Thanks,
-Todd Elliott |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
On WinVICE, Dom 17 will jam on that screen if true drive emulation isn't enabled if memory serves...? |
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JCB
Account closed
Registered: Jun 2002
Posts: 241 |
Yeah, works fine on winvice with true drive emulation turned on. |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
WinVICE 1.10 works fine. Real C64 works even better :>
Just to clear something up, Raver described Scene World as pathetic, but do not take it out of context, he respects it as an effort on the C64.
All stuff released on C64 should be respected, whether people like it or not is totally up to them.
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Puterman
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 188 |
Yeah, real C-64 works. Not with retro replay, though. And real C-128 doesn't work here either. |
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taper
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 119 |
Strange. My main machine is a c128, and Domination works without any problems at all. I also have a Retroreplay, and I have no problems using that one while running Domination either. Perhaps something is whack with your setup, Puterman? |
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Puterman
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 188 |
Yes probably, but my machines work with most releases. |
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Ninja
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 407 |
I also use a C128 with RR and DOM#17 works flawlessly. |
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Slator
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 273 |
It works on all systems on which I use to read it through the time. 128, 128-metal, c64, c64-2. With RR/Ar6/FC3/Jiffy Dos
puterman, maybe it is caused by your swedish rom in the 128 ?
I remember the vandalism editor fucking up on a swedish c128 on lcp, maybe it is the same problem ? |
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MagerValp
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 1059 |
It sounded like Raven had found the problem, something about variances in rotational speed between various drives. Try another disk drive or wait for the fixed version...
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Stryyker
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 465 |
I also found Dom 17 didn't like my RR (3.8A with SS enabled), after the intro it would freeze. I simple disabled cart and it worked. |
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Puterman
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 188 |
stryyker: Same here. I guess it's not the Swedish ROM then. :-) |
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Slator
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 273 |
hm, I don't use the RR 3.8 rom in daily work. I prefer the Triad rom, because of the black starting piccy..
and it runs well there.
LOL, and the swedish rom was just a guess :D
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taper
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 119 |
Ahyes, I mostly run the TRIAD rom aswell, for obvious reasons... :) |
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The Overkiller
Account closed
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 342 |
Quote: Overkiller: You were upset? Well, it is pretty pathetic.
Not from my side, sorry !!! |
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Jazzcat
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1044 |
My Retro Replay works fine with Domination.
The main thing is that it works on C64, if it doesn't work on AR/RR I am not concerned, as these can be unplugged.
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Count Zero
Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 1825 |
Yeah ... AR/RR always works fine for me aswell ... :)))
Maybe I even find time soonish to do something for more compatibility.
For heavens sake I check such forums here so rarely that I even tend to forget my PW. :)
However, sentences from the original post such as:
>But from now on, I think I should let other groups try
>first releases of my work - for competition, no matter what.
make me smile .. foolish little penguins creating software where intro-makers come back to reality ...
l8r
Count Zero
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Hello there!
I would also like to add some words, here.
Well, this topic got expand a lot.
As for Richard games; I like them. As re-cracking or any lame group label: I don't think such things are really necessary.
Why to start a lame label to fool or have some fun?!
If instead, a real group label would do something instead of a lame group label, it would be more productive.
I don't think there is a need to do mistakes twice.
As for Richards games, tunes, texts, etc: I like them a lot!
And well also his games are quite funny sometimes.
I mean, it makes just fun to play them; So, I want to say: "Well done!".
I agree with Moloch: Meanwhile time has surely changed.
It is very fair of Richard to excuse, but the whole "DOM Shit News" things doesn't annoy me too much, I mean there are more important things in C64 scene to face!
Richard really wants to help anybody and I never had the feeling, that he wanted to fool or annoy anybody.
He is a great scene supporter and I hope he will keep doing so always! I think many sceners and productions would never have come that far without it his help.
I am really greatful for his support and I appreciate it a lot.
I agree with rOuGh, there is no need to excuse such many times.
This discussion goes a fairly fair way!
As for "Domination": I think there is no need to do a change about magsys or such. I had more troubles with "Vandalism" about crashes, but never had any troubles with "Domination". It gives a special feeling by reading!
So, please keep it that way!
Well, about "SWO":
It's like "The Overkiller" said: I am not too happy about this "pathetic" comment, also.
I know, not everybody will like our style of "SWO" diskmag and well, we don't follow other diskmags. Why should be "copy" concepts and ways from other diskmags?!
I think it's better to hove one's own way and style.
Some like it, some not.
But the amount of people who like it, is (in my eyes) bigger than the people who don't like it.
On the other side, in same issue of "Domination" they left some nice comments about SWO and "P.o.L." so thanks to them, too!
I hope I haven't forgot anything! :)
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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hollowman
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 474 |
>But the amount of people who like it, is (in my eyes) >bigger than the people who don't like it.
>On the other side, in same issue of "Domination" they left >some nice comments about SWO and "P.o.L." so thanks to >them, too!
you might think so, but then on the remainings of the c64 scene today it is customary to just pat your friends on the back and never say anything negative.
i havent talked to anyone yet who actually likes sceneworld, and i dont like the magazine either. i think the name isnt very well chosen since most people think of the crackingscene or the demoscene when they hear it, and might think that they will get a good view on whats going on if they read the mag. i could criticize the content, but there is hardly any.
there is surely people who like the magazine, but then there are people who are satisfied with playing richards
games and watching "demos" such as the contributions to the christmas compo aswell. |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: >But the amount of people who like it, is (in my eyes) >bigger than the people who don't like it.
>On the other side, in same issue of "Domination" they left >some nice comments about SWO and "P.o.L." so thanks to >them, too!
you might think so, but then on the remainings of the c64 scene today it is customary to just pat your friends on the back and never say anything negative.
i havent talked to anyone yet who actually likes sceneworld, and i dont like the magazine either. i think the name isnt very well chosen since most people think of the crackingscene or the demoscene when they hear it, and might think that they will get a good view on whats going on if they read the mag. i could criticize the content, but there is hardly any.
there is surely people who like the magazine, but then there are people who are satisfied with playing richards
games and watching "demos" such as the contributions to the christmas compo aswell.
Okay, but then you would have to say, that every diskmag which doesn't cover demo/cracking scene mainly or only is bad.
I mean, for example "Arachnophobia" does not contain too much cracking scene and is also more around the whole scene, than just only demo and cracking one.
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Yep, people shouldn't fear death of C64scene that much as to accept shit-magazines, shit-games, shit-demos etc.
If one doesn't have time or skill to do it properly, it'd be better to not do it at all. Or at least, don't release it to public. :)
Now that wasn't friendly wasn't it? |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Yep, people shouldn't fear death of C64scene that much as to accept shit-magazines, shit-games, shit-demos etc.
If one doesn't have time or skill to do it properly, it'd be better to not do it at all. Or at least, don't release it to public. :)
Now that wasn't friendly wasn't it?
But what's shit or not shit is very subjective and can't said in general.
Everybody is entitled to his meaning, but everybody has different taste.
Well, well, fraindly or not, it is your honest point of view, Lasse!
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Yes, of course it is subjective. Simply, no-one should hold back any personal opinions, negative or positive, just because of "supporting the C64 scene", IMO :) |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Yes, of course it is subjective. Simply, no-one should hold back any personal opinions, negative or positive, just because of "supporting the C64 scene", IMO :)
Okay, good that we think the same.
It doesn't mean, if things are "shit" for me, that they are automatically shit for others or in general!
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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Eyeth
Account closed
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 98 |
Quote: Yes, of course it is subjective. Simply, no-one should hold back any personal opinions, negative or positive, just because of "supporting the C64 scene", IMO :)
Hello.
I feel this happens a lot in the NTSC scene; We're far too polite when it comes to new NTSC releases, because they are scarce lately.
We want to encourage further artistic innovation for our CBM's in the NTSC scene and thus, refrain from such criticism.
I do find the PAL scene more refreshing; They do criticize and demand better work. But will the PAL scene change if releases become a lot more scarcer like it has here in NTSC-land?
Either way, I have a thick skin. I've released some stuff and some people said my efforts weren't good. I just take it as constructive criticism and strive to be better.
Enjoy! :)
-Todd Elliott |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Hello.
I feel this happens a lot in the NTSC scene; We're far too polite when it comes to new NTSC releases, because they are scarce lately.
We want to encourage further artistic innovation for our CBM's in the NTSC scene and thus, refrain from such criticism.
I do find the PAL scene more refreshing; They do criticize and demand better work. But will the PAL scene change if releases become a lot more scarcer like it has here in NTSC-land?
Either way, I have a thick skin. I've released some stuff and some people said my efforts weren't good. I just take it as constructive criticism and strive to be better.
Enjoy! :)
-Todd Elliott
Yes, Todd, there is much truth in that what you say.
Anyway, I like the NTSC scene a lot, too!
I hope there will come some fresh wind and new stuff there in NTSC demo scene, too!
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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Puterman
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 188 |
I like the NTSC scene too, 2 really lame 1-part demos released in 2002, wow! |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: I like the NTSC scene too, 2 really lame 1-part demos released in 2002, wow!
But anyway, there is something released and it's not for everybody lame!
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
While things are subjective, this is just the argument I won't be defending: that "something released" is enough and we should somehow be content with that.
We should demand productions that surpass or at least equal the best works of the past; I am not an expert on demos so I will refrain comment but for games, to be honest, only Enhanced Newcomer has been a *truly* worthy release in the past few years (yes, this includes the quite shitty, as I think of it now, MW trilogy, for which no-one has written a honest review so far, that would also question its value and expose its numerous flaws)
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Commander
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 106 |
There is a difference between giving critics and making somebody ashame/attacking somebody (saying that he better can't release anything than something)... If some people doesn't learn to give critics instead of trying to tell only shit about someone, then this scene will go the same way as it did at the end of 1992. A pitty, all this hostility, but lucky for us : most of the active sceners are more friendly.
You can give critics in two ways :
-You give some critics about what's bad/good and maybe some advise. If that person can't do better, then let it for what it is. Everybody counts!!!!!!
-You can give some critics about what's bad and you say that this person/group better can't release any stuff anymore. (the elite-kind system of the old days which went too far in 1992, it causes the leaving of many sceners)
And I am sure there will be again some attacks on my words... but I don't care because I know that most of us like each other and try to keep the scene one family without talking shit only...
Have a good New Year and try to give critics without hurting someone!
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
IMO, if the truth makes someone ashamed, then there's nothing wrong with that. I don't advocate saying "someone shouldn't release any more stuff" but for example, I stand 100% behind my public analyses of Rich's coding skill, which may seem negative or offensive at places |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: While things are subjective, this is just the argument I won't be defending: that "something released" is enough and we should somehow be content with that.
We should demand productions that surpass or at least equal the best works of the past; I am not an expert on demos so I will refrain comment but for games, to be honest, only Enhanced Newcomer has been a *truly* worthy release in the past few years (yes, this includes the quite shitty, as I think of it now, MW trilogy, for which no-one has written a honest review so far, that would also question its value and expose its numerous flaws)
Well, you just have also to see the differences between NTSC and PAL scene, do you?!
Well, I like MW triologies, and if we would get appeared with "SWO" erlier, you could have await a honest and fair review. But there is still one part to come! ;)
But we are all just humans among many C64 sceners.
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: There is a difference between giving critics and making somebody ashame/attacking somebody (saying that he better can't release anything than something)... If some people doesn't learn to give critics instead of trying to tell only shit about someone, then this scene will go the same way as it did at the end of 1992. A pitty, all this hostility, but lucky for us : most of the active sceners are more friendly.
You can give critics in two ways :
-You give some critics about what's bad/good and maybe some advise. If that person can't do better, then let it for what it is. Everybody counts!!!!!!
-You can give some critics about what's bad and you say that this person/group better can't release any stuff anymore. (the elite-kind system of the old days which went too far in 1992, it causes the leaving of many sceners)
And I am sure there will be again some attacks on my words... but I don't care because I know that most of us like each other and try to keep the scene one family without talking shit only...
Have a good New Year and try to give critics without hurting someone!
This reminds to the fact that Serge did not like my way of telling critics, first.
But we fixed that. :)
Don't think, charity begins at home. Think also about the feelings that person would get when you write those critics.
Another example:
"Your release XYZ is shit!!!" - "Why?!" - "Because It Is Shit!".
Would such a critic help?!
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Simple, NTSC guys should try to surpass the best past works of the NTSC scene :)
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CyberBrain
Administrator
Posts: 392 |
There are things that suck, where you have to be 'very subjective' to like it. But still, it's okay that it's being released. We don't need censorship on stuff just because it sucks like hell :)
about richards games: the *few* (2 or 3 - i'm not so much a game-person) i've tried i think were okay. No extreme coding, but they were fun enough to play, and i guess that was the point. |
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Commander
Account closed
Registered: Jan 2002
Posts: 106 |
Cadaver:
Did you think that my words were for you...? Well, if you think so...
But my words were for all sceners, the general scene. And the ones who think that some of my words suits him, he better can think about it.
Cadaver: you maybe don't tell someone to stop, but some others are doing or it sounds like they are thinking that way.
I can give also bad critics, but these critics don't have to hurt someone. I can say to some one : "Hey, your gfx doesn't suit me well." instead of "Hey, your gfx are shit, stop with that!".
Anyway, thanks for reading my words...
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Simple, NTSC guys should try to surpass the best past works of the NTSC scene :)
Well, then they need a motivation maker. Most NTSCeners are allrounders and single worker!...
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: There are things that suck, where you have to be 'very subjective' to like it. But still, it's okay that it's being released. We don't need censorship on stuff just because it sucks like hell :)
about richards games: the *few* (2 or 3 - i'm not so much a game-person) i've tried i think were okay. No extreme coding, but they were fun enough to play, and i guess that was the point.
Bjarke, you really understood what I mean! Thanks! :)
I am not alone anymore with my opinion, that's nice! Really!
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Cadaver:
Did you think that my words were for you...? Well, if you think so...
But my words were for all sceners, the general scene. And the ones who think that some of my words suits him, he better can think about it.
Cadaver: you maybe don't tell someone to stop, but some others are doing or it sounds like they are thinking that way.
I can give also bad critics, but these critics don't have to hurt someone. I can say to some one : "Hey, your gfx doesn't suit me well." instead of "Hey, your gfx are shit, stop with that!".
Anyway, thanks for reading my words...
There is something most people forget about:
Everbody had a start, and surely started with something little (=shit for some), but they are all improving!
We are hopefully all improving!
That's the hope and thinking I have!
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
No censorship needed.. It's all in what the author wants to achieve, and what the audience wants to see, it should be self-regulating :)
As for Rich's games, I agree they can be enjoyable in their own way, at least for a short time. I just wish he would stop advertising them like he's the sole saviour of the C64 game scene, or something :)
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Commander: I sent you a PM but to clarify to the rest, no I didn't think. |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: No censorship needed.. It's all in what the author wants to achieve, and what the audience wants to see, it should be self-regulating :)
As for Rich's games, I agree they can be enjoyable in their own way, at least for a short time. I just wish he would stop advertising them like he's the sole saviour of the C64 game scene, or something :)
Okay, well, so there are not tooo bad in your eyes...
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Btw. the reason for these quite bitter messages on my part is the built-up anger from implementing yet another GoatTracker feature, that (as usual) I won't use myself.. This is absolutely the last time I give in... |
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Nafcom
Registered: Apr 2002
Posts: 588 |
Quote: Btw. the reason for these quite bitter messages on my part is the built-up anger from implementing yet another GoatTracker feature, that (as usual) I won't use myself.. This is absolutely the last time I give in...
Hmm, sorry, did not know about!
All the best!
Bye!
Joerg
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Hey Cadaver, whilst you're in the Goat source any chance of adding... [grins, ducks, runs like fuck! =-] |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Hehe :) Well if you're not asking for sample channel, it can't be that bad... |
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CyberBrain
Administrator
Posts: 392 |
How about file-compatibility with Cubase or Logic? I guess you've heard that a 1024 times before, but it would be very cool, and i think most of GoatTrackers users wants that.
Another thing i would like to see in GoatTracker would be a graphics editor. When i sit and listens to music i feel it makes me feel the music better if i can sit and draw at the same time. Doesn't need to be anything fancy, just something like photoshop or something.
Finally i've often wondered why GoatTracker can't browse the web. I've talked to a lot of GoatTracker users and they all (without i even came close to the subject) complained to me that goattracker can't browse the web. Also a ftp-server/client would be a good thing.
Well, these are just minor things but still things which SCREAMS to be included in goattracker - i would allmost call it a bug that they are not there allready. Hope you'll make it for the next release - it REALLY needs to be done!
[runs after TMR] |
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Dane
Account closed
Registered: May 2002
Posts: 421 |
These are really good suggestions for the next generation of graphics editors from Crest :) XL-Fli, anyone? |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Guys, you forgot the most basic, *fundamental* features, conversion of any SID-file to Goattracker song format, and analysis of any WAV-file into a Goattracker instrument!!!
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
(ok, obviously these are so fundamental that they don't need to be included). Obviously, a C64 programming development IDE with Turbo Assembler compatible assembler, but with ability to produce either C64, SCPU, or C=1 programs, would also be a necessary addition. And a C64 graphics editor with support for all modes ever invented :) |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Bah, to not forget the all-useful PC activities, Wolfenstein3D, Doom, Duke3D, Quake, Halflife, Thief and Unreal map-editors, and a 3D modeller with conversion plugins for at least the aforementioned games should be also included. :) |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
As a conclusion, it seems I've now some work cut out for me. Do not expect MW4 before 2010. :) |
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CyberBrain
Administrator
Posts: 392 |
ha ha ! When will the next version of GoatTracker be out then? |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Ah, now I understand that GoatTracker needs actually to become a whole 32-bit multitasking OS, to create a total enviroment of development freedom, and unparalleled connectivity & stability.
It'd be safe to say that it'll be out in 2009, then :) |
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CyberBrain
Administrator
Posts: 392 |
:) I guess it really IS harder to code on PC than on C64, if something as trivial as coding a 100% stable 32-bit multitasking OS takes so long time...
(On C64 that would be totally easy - just a couple of days of code, for that 32-bit mulatiasking OS. Maybe that's why noone has done it on C64? It's too easy? The real challenge on a C64 is ofcause to make demos)
But still, it would be a logical step for the next version of GoatTracker (and a NEEDED step!!!!!) |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Remember, that it will be a multiplatform OS (using the portable Simple Directmedia Layer) so all testing etc. required leads to more time taken
Confusing...? :) |
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CreaMD
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 3036 |
8-O |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
Erm... yes. Or no? All i wanted was a ProTracker loader/converter i didn't expect the Spanish Inquisition!! =-) |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Would it perhaps feature, some kind of AI to squeeze the musical arrangement of <n> channels into 3? :) |
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T.M.R
Account closed
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 749 |
No, just to load the original and select which three of the four was to be preserved - the only other thing it'd need to do is optimise down so that a repeated bassline only appears the once in the final file. =-) |
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cadaver
Registered: Feb 2002
Posts: 1154 |
Naturally, was just joking according to the previous megalomaniacal posts :)
In fact, this can be done, and easily. Can't say when, though :) It's better to do as an external utility than integrating into GT.
Btw. it's likely that commands like portamento & vibrato need adjustment afterwards, and all of them can't even be converted... |
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Raistlin
Registered: Mar 2007
Posts: 575 |
Quote: Ah, now I understand that GoatTracker needs actually to become a whole 32-bit multitasking OS, to create a total enviroment of development freedom, and unparalleled connectivity & stability.
It'd be safe to say that it'll be out in 2009, then :)
21 years later, it should be ready now, right? Or were we slowed moving it over to a 64-bit multitasking OS? |
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chatGPZ
Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 11145 |
Necroing like a boss :D |
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TheRyk
Registered: Mar 2009
Posts: 2083 |
golden shower of lyrics, however:
Quoting Richard
I was really pissed off and we were suspicious that Jazzcat could have been behind the prank, after the Urine release had proved to be some fake. Urine tried to re-release the proper version of Bomb Chase but failed, because I asked all FTP owners to remove the release, as I had a feeling that Urine was really going to piss hard on my work. ...
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Raistlin
Registered: Mar 2007
Posts: 575 |
Haha, someone suspicious of Jazzcat 2 decades ago? *Shock* .. some things never change (congrats again, Onslaught, on winning the Quality Crack Award in your own mag - you really do have a quality, shiny crack ;p). |
